並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ep-83-%E6%A0%A1%E5%9C%92%E8%A9%AD%E4%BA%8B-%E5%8F%B0%E7%81%A3%E5%8D%81%E5%A4%A7%E6%A0%A1%E5%9C%92%E9%AC%BC%E6%95%85%E4%BA%8B-%E4%BD%A0%E7%9A%84%E5%AD%B8%E6%A0%A1%E4%B8%8A%E6%A6%9C%E4%BA%86%E5%97%8E/id1526048089?i=1000521909971